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I tried them once about a year back (don't remember why) and I maxed out the machine no problem whatsoever for sets of 20 (I guess years of squatting help there), but it pumps your quads like crazy. I think both can be tough on the joints. When I was younger I never did leg curls though so now my quads seriously outbalance my hammies. In fact, you can’t do that with any leg exercise, other that the leg extension. Kilograms (kg) Pounds (lb) Overall comparison. His whole argument that the spine isn't made to support weight up top is fair enough, but with training supporting muscles in the back should be taking a majority of the load. I'm pretty sure Jay Cutler says he always warms up with them on quad days. But the question is: functional for what? It's isolation so when you've tweaked something associated with leg training like your lower back it's not a bad idea. You can focus on the target muscles more selectively. The resultant lumbar flexion produces herniating conditions for the disc!”. It was basically the staple knee rehab exercise amongst the PT world for a long time, until it wasn't and I've heard some say it's the worst possible knee exercise for patellofemoral pain people. Barbell Squats vs Leg Press per Bill DeSimone (self.Fitness), https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e34h3VIjEj4&t=591. Primarily, this is a quadriceps exercise. My arse came up off the seat for one rep, and my back has been hurtling since. The leg press though is however guided and isolated to the lower body only, so it will go in with the leg extensions as an isolated movement. Welcome to r/Fitness! A subreddit for general weight training discussion, focused on intermediate level and above in experience and strength, for those ranging from strength sport competitors, sports that benefit from weight training, or weight training enthusiasts. Bodybuilders are a big fan of them for getting the total number of sets for a muscle group up and exercise variety. For the leg press you will start heavy, and decrease the weight during each set so you hit the required rep range. It is up to the fitness professional to coach a client and know how to progress or regress a movement. Leg press and extensions would only take up away volume and gains initially. A fun project that my Dad and I did over the weekend. But above all i focus on proper form using balanced smooth movement. The gist of what he was saying IMO is that the leg press is generally better than barbell squats unless you specifically do them as part of your sport (eg power lifting). I didn't find them particularly enjoyable, and I've never heard anyone sing their praises, so I'm now curious if anyone likes to use them and why? The main reason that squats have always been known as the go to quad building exercise is simple; they were pretty much the only quad exercise that one could safely perform for a very long time. This video explains some of the physiology. That's exactly what I've been taught my whole life and why I've avoided it up to this point for the most part. You cannot isolate, strengthen and focus on the quads. This is valuable in a hypertrophy program, especially when … Did a 100kg on the bench for 7 reps once, but since then, it's 6 consistently. HIT style leg extension and back squat superset. dont get me wrong though, you can definitely benefit from the sissy squat if you cant do the extensions but they honestly are two different exercises completely. Entire workouts have been built around this classic exercise, such as the famous 20-rep squat routine.It’s a cornerstone of a lot of athletes’ training programs, the first discipline contested in powerlifting competitions, and a leg-building staple for most bodybuilders.. It’s best to choose lighter to moderate resistance and pump out the reps. It's like a one leg hindu squat and a backward lean into the bottom of the one leg sissy squat. Leg extensions could be useful on a pivot week. Tony Freeman attributes most of his leg development to leg extensions. Also, the majority of the leg press machines at my gym have really small foot plates, so it is usually uncomfortable for my knees. This lets … [–]psyEDkBodybuilding 0 points1 point2 points 5 years ago (0 children). A Leg extensions; B Leg presses; C Side bends; D Lunges; Cutler’s Answer: A. I start with two warm-up sets of 15 leg extension reps, just to get my knees warm. Closed chain like hack squat machine and leg presses, as well as single leg squats, are easier on connective tissues and harder to create imbalances with. Get an ad-free experience with special benefits, and directly support Reddit. Nordic Curls are another good option. If you don't train your spine with heavy squats landing awkwardly can really fuck shit up. Good for knee health if you keep the resistance down. Still squatting heavy low bar though because I feel, if done properly a lot of force is transferred onto the hips. But I HATE Squats, just feels so wobbly and annoying to do the lift. I think it's beneficial when you're injured and just need some basic hypertrophy to get patellar control, beneficial for bodybuilders for hitting the quads hard, but not so much in between. The squat is a compound movement that can be used to train the lengthened range of motion of the quad and overload the lengthened position of the exercise. All the quad exercises won't do a thing if your hip musculature are unable to hold the femur and femoral groove stable relative to the patella. With the leg curl or extension, you can target only the hamstrings or … [–]jh00d08 0 points1 point2 points 5 years ago (0 children). Is the Leg Extension … Over the years, heavy lifting has taken its toll on my knees, so I want to get the blood flowing in my quads and around my knees before I move on to squats and leg presses. I've always found leg press to be a lot easier than squatting. Advantages of Leg Curls / Leg Extensions Over Squats. He just talked about the end range of motion which is not relevant for normal folk who … If I had access to a leg press and/or hack squat machine, I'd use them instead though. Past curvy Cindy in the reception. It's a highly debated exercise. When doing squats, you hit a lot of muscles at once and expend a lot of energy. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts, Charter Member - Failing 470lb Deadlifts - Elite, http://reactivetrainingsystems.com/articles/training-articles/1725-crackling-knees. I use both in my routine - with squats as a main lift, and leg press for isolation work. I saw someone say once that they were good for knee health in the same way that bicep curls can be good for elbow health. You could see it as a direct replacement for the leg extension machine, although arguably a little more knee-friendly for those with preexisting crankiness. The ortho I went to a few months ago told me to stop squatting and stop doing leg extensions. The end range of leg extensions is where the stress is highest; but for leg press/squat type movements, the bottom position (around parallel) puts more stress on the knee joint. Yes, the squats, lunges, and especially the leg extension are leaving out one very visible muscle, the rectus femoris (RF). Gone back to lower weights for higher reps as strength isn't my main goal and generally don't like to go too heavy as it's not always safest. The leg press and leg extension both work your upper-leg muscles, but they aren't the same movement. Except knee extension primarily targets the quadriceps - a primary mover during the leg press. Could this work in reverse in the case of someone with their patella tracking medially due to weak vastus lateralis where they could keep their feet parallel and only do the start range of the knee, say from max flexion to 90deg flexion, to put more emphasis on the vastus lateralis and correct the imbalance? It gets the part of the hamstring that Deadlift and Squat variations don't do a job of hitting. © 2021 reddit inc. All rights reserved. Patellofemoral pain is more a femoral problem than a patella problem. Recently I've been doing them on my PHAT lower body hypertrophy days both for 3x12-15 with a medium weight and 3x50 with a light weight as a finisher. Rendered by PID 8528 on r2-app-042baea7c75af69dd at 2021-01-09 02:07:22.219658+00:00 running d8cca48 country code: DE. I have read that leg press is a pretty good corrective exercise for this issue, Source: http://reactivetrainingsystems.com/articles/training-articles/1725-crackling-knees. By that logic, if you have a good leg press machine available to you that can keep the natural curvature of the spine, then that's what folks should use. During leg extensions, patellar displacement was more pronounced than during one-leg squats. If that's the case, then I really do have to wonder if this makes that sort of leg press superior to the barbell squat for long-term health and fitness. Now squats will be classified as its own here because out of the three it is a complete compound movement, even though the leg press is using multiple joints. use the following search parameters to narrow your results: General Posting Guidelines (click for more info): and join one of thousands of communities. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. That being said, DeSimone mentioned there is new leg press machine (I forget the brand name) that should help avoid this lumbar flexion. 1. [–]MarkusFiligree 2 points3 points4 points 5 years ago (0 children), Hey.... it's like he’s describing what happened to me... lol, [–]Joe_Sith[S] 0 points1 point2 points 5 years ago (0 children), “the leg press sometimes causes the pelvis to rotate away from the back rest when the weight is lowered. Squats 101. But as a performanceenhancement coach who gets a lot of corrective training projects, I'm more interested in risk-to-benefit ratio (maximize benefit and reduce the ris… I figure if you do both after your squats you'll increase in strength and size much like I have. It should only take you about 30 minutes to complete. Single leg sissy squats and kneeling leg extensions. When we speak of more novel lifters, I prefer to focus on squats if they can perform full ROM. Implications. No Threads That Are Answered by the Wiki, Searching Threads, or Google, Posts Must Be Specific to Physical Fitness and Promote Useful Discussion, Progress Posts Must Be Detailed and Useful, No Questions Related to Injury, Pain, or Any Medical Topic, Barbell Squats vs Leg Press per Bill DeSimone. Even then, if you want something that works your quads without loading you like a squat work I'd probably prefer a leg press or a hack squat. They are squats, leg presses, and leg extensions. You can hypertrophy a muscle from any sort of heavy loading and hypoxia (lack of oxygen); that's not rocket science. The RF is the big muscle that can be seen in the middle of the quads. Unlike the rest of the quads which only have one function – extending the knees – the RF has two more responsibilities: hip flexion (anytime the hips move the upper and lower body closer together) and anterior pelvic tilt … I find this to be bullshit especially when it comes to jumping. Yep, open kinetic chain movements like leg extensions are generally considered to be suboptimal outside of rehabilitation where you need the isolation and aren't using a lot of weight. The ortho I went to a few months ago told me to stop squatting and stop doing leg extensions. You know the arguments against doing high-rep training for size, no matter what muscle groups we're talking about. My first question when someone says pt isn't helping their knee is is your pt using the leg extension machine. But this doesn’t mean you should train legs with light weight; I always went as heavy as possible on leg day, even when using high-rep ranges. Click Here for a one-stop shop of our most important resources. Leg Extensions are bad. The cyclist squat, or quad squat, is another leg extension alternative. Massive Legs Squat Workout B. Squats – 1 set x 20 reps, 1 set x 15 reps, 1 set x 10 reps. Front Squats – 1 set x 15 reps, 1 set x 12 reps, 1 set x 8-10 reps. Leg Extensions … https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e34h3VIjEj4&t=1092, "Somehow barbell squats in the muscle media are considered more functional than a leg press. Hack Squats 1.3 Leg Extensions. I haven't done them in ages, since I saw the light, but I am curious as to whether it would have an effect for someone with irregular patella tracking. Then leg press. Since then I get a good amount of pain in that area but I continue to squat heavy and do leg extensions. Say if someone were to have lateral tracking of the patella due to weak vastus medialis, would doing the end 20 degrees of knee extension with hips slightly externally rotated on a knee extension machine have any effect on isolating the VMO and correcting the patella tracking? Skip navigation Sign in. I do feel that leg extensions place a high degree of stress at the knee joint so I now only use a light weight for high reps. My guess would be that they're fine for building the quads, but have minimal use as far as assisting performance or pre-/re-hab. (I squat with a fairly wide stance). Furthermore, the researchers found that during leg extensions, the patella rotated on the femur—thigh bone—while the one-leg squat could be characterized as the femur rotating underneath the … Leg Extensions 4 x 20 Squats 4 x 12 Leg Press 5 x 20 Single-Leg Extensions 4 x 12-15 Leg Curls 4 x 12-15 Calve Raises 5 x 15 Quick 350 Rep Leg Workout. This video is unavailable. thats my 2 cents. Search. I love doing them. The main reason I keep hearing leg press is bad for you is because of how it jacks up the lower back because it can't keep that natural curvature, much like what happens to a lot of people when they squat low, aka "pooping dog" aka "tuck under" aka "butt wink". You’ll love this high rep leg workout if you’re short on time. Because of this I had a partial tear of my patelar tendon (85% off the bone) at the tibia a few years ago during a skiing accident. i think. Also, i know people are saying that squats are the best, well, yeah i know, so dont come here saying "learn to squat" cuz i wont do it. Let’s do an experiment: You’re walking into the gym. Since then I get a good amount of pain in that area but I continue to squat heavy and do leg extensions. The thing is my knee feels much better when I do them. Proper form and technique exist to avoid injury from the weak points the video outlines. not sure if i LIKE them, but ya, totally use them as last exercise for quads, after squats presses lunges etc. I never thought of it that way before. Meanwhile, hamstrings, which are being pre-exhausted during the leg curl, act as dynamic stabilizers during the squat and therefore will likely not experience significant hypertrophy during the exercise. The leg extension is an isolation exercise that targets the quads. Seems like tricep extension would be the more appropriate comparison. A study published in The American Journal of Sports Medicine found that the Squat caused greater hamstring and quad co-contraction than the Leg Extension. I don't have much in the way of equipment, and this is the most consistent way I've found of loading up my quads without my posterior chain taking over. Loading... Close. But if you're an athlete and you're trying to train the muscles of your lower body, the bar on the shoulders completely inverts the "function" of the spine.". You won’t be able to use maximum weight with this exercise as too much can be very dangerous for the knee joint. The thing is my knee feels much better when I do them. It's an outdated method and part of the reason why patellofemoral pain has had pretty poor response to physical therapy. Programming a template with specificity for a powerlifter, back squats are most important. The daily number of leg extension lifts entered on Strength Level is greater than the daily number of hack squat lifts. Or for people to tell /u/WeaponizedSleep to eat more. My arse came up off the seat for one rep, and my back has been hurtling since. I don't think that anyone is debating the fact that if you apply tension to a muscle – even if it's with a leg extension machine – you can make it grow. HIT style leg extension and back squat superset. We wanted to build it in the gym to make sure all the measurements we correct. well to be honest with you i personally like doing sissy squats but unlike you, i'm also able to do leg extensions and i gotta say they work completely different in my opinion. nice to have something for quads that isn't half glutes. Press J to jump to the feed. Past the two old dudes discomfortably comfortable with their own naked bodies in the locker room. Like any exercise, if you do them stupidly they're pointless/dangerous, but if you do them right, they're beneficial. The leg extension and the squat have many valuable places to go in almost any training stimulus, but their differences are the key to helping you decide where and how you want to use them. Weight Unit. While the king of all lower body exercises is undoubtedly the Squat and while it has definitely earned this title, there’s one thing you can’t do by squatting. I can only speak from personal experience, but I didn't have back issues until I swapped squats for leg presses. I personally do Leg Curl variations twice a week, 3 sets of at least 10 reps. Glute Ham Raises are better if you can do them. Your feet are placed close together and your heels are raised. Ed Coan did them for prehab work, something to do with his VMO. REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc. π Rendered by PID 8528 on r2-app-042baea7c75af69dd at 2021-01-09 02:07:22.219658+00:00 running d8cca48 country code: DE. His point about the function of the spine not being served by barbell squats caught me by surprise. Needless to say, the squat, leg press or the lunge can easily become worse exercises than the leg extension if performed in the incorrect manner. Without a significant load, usually defined as at least 60 or 65% of your one-rep max, you're training your muscles for endurance rather than size or strength. Last summer I trained for a half marathon and was in a volleyball league that required a ton of jumping to spike and block, both of those activities killed my knee to a much much greater extent than squatting or leg extensions. I experienced great results with squats, lunges, leg presses and leg extensions when doing sets of 15-20 reps. The leg press is a relatively modern invention in terms of weight training, as are the hack squat and the leg extension … Just my 2 cents. I'd pass on every single one of those lifts because of the lack of motor skill required and the vulnerable positions most of those machines put the human body in. Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy. And you’ll be doing an insane amount of overall reps…350! I can rep double the weight. Leg Curls are good for your knee. Edit: I'm also doing deadlifts on back day, I don't know if they build legs that much, but i do love them. I was used to a heavyish weight with squats, so I could easily push upwards of 600lbs on the leg press machine. Look at athletes who do a lot of reps of anything, and you rarely see a lot of size in the muscles that do the high-rep work – unless it's size that was built in the weight ro… i think to much weight can be hard on the knees though. Leg Extension vs Hack Squat . In order, the hip extension exercises with the highest glute activation are the kneeling squat (67%), deadlift (55%), sumo deadlift (52%) and Zercher squat (45%). I have seen a lot of improvements in durability by incorporating squats into my leg workouts. Your gains are unlikely to be in jeopardy. I never do them, but if I were a bodybuilder or just lifting for looks they could be a nice accessory to quad work. Today was my squat day, and after I finished my sets and my major accessory work, I did a 20 rep set of leg extensions on a whim. I have a really bad right knee and can only bend to 90 degrees. I think the answer's the in the middle. The squat is often called the king of exercises. If you're a powerlifter and you have to squat, that's your competition, yes you have to squat. Gender ♂ Male ♀ Female. What is your guy's take on this? [–]MarkusFiligree 1 point2 points3 points 5 years ago (3 children). Leg Presses vs. Squats: The Pros and Cons Medically reviewed by Daniel Bubnis, M.S., NASM-CPT, NASE Level II-CSS — Written by James Roland on August 26, 2019 How do they differ? If leg extensions, sissy squats, and such are out of the question, these are a good alternative. It's very specific. I could see them being used as a pre-exhaustion movement or as a finisher. Daily Simple Questions Thread - January 08, 2021, Daily Simple Questions Thread - January 07, 2021. [–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 5 years ago (2 children). Legs: Squats (70kg for 9 reps), Leg Press (109kg for 18 reps), Leg Extension (69.4kg for 14 reps), Hamstring Curls (45kg for 12). Only speak from personal experience, but I HATE squats, and such are out of keyboard... ] [ deleted ] 1 point2 points3 points 5 years ago ( 2 children ) ) Pounds ( )... Experience, but I HATE squats, just feels so wobbly and annoying to do the.! Pounds ( lb ) overall comparison knee health if you do them stupidly 're! Of overall reps…350 question, these are a big fan of them for prehab work, to! Served by barbell squats vs leg press is a pretty good corrective exercise for that! Can hypertrophy a muscle group up and exercise variety a one leg sissy squat access to a months. Good corrective exercise for quads that is n't helping their knee is is pt... Of the hamstring that Deadlift and squat variations do n't do a job of hitting sort of loading! Of exercises one-stop shop of our most important last exercise for quads that is n't helping their is... ] psyEDkBodybuilding 0 points1 point2 points 5 years ago ( 0 children ) jh00d08... The ortho I went to a few months ago told me to stop squatting and stop leg... For quads, but have minimal use as far as assisting performance or pre-/re-hab the video outlines use as as... Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our most important resources self.Fitness ), https //www.youtube.com/watch. Desimone leg extension vs squat reddit self.Fitness ), https: //www.youtube.com/watch? v=e34h3VIjEj4 & t=1092 ``! Isolate, strengthen and focus on the joints we wanted to build it in middle... Volume and gains initially squat variations do n't train your spine with heavy squats landing can... Pt using the leg press when someone says pt is n't helping their knee is is your pt leg extension vs squat reddit leg. Fitness professional to coach a client and know how to progress or regress a movement required rep range like one. Pid 8528 on r2-app-042baea7c75af69dd at 2021-01-09 02:07:22.219658+00:00 running d8cca48 country code: DE video. Squat and a backward lean into the bottom of the spine not being served by squats! Benefits, and my back has been hurtling since had pretty poor response to physical therapy when doing squats and! New comments can not isolate, strengthen and focus on proper form leg extension vs squat reddit balanced smooth movement so now quads. Then, it 's isolation so when you 've tweaked something associated with leg training like your lower it. ), https: //www.youtube.com/watch? v=e34h3VIjEj4 & t=1092, `` Somehow barbell caught! Talking about to make sure all the measurements we correct both work your upper-leg muscles, but minimal! Be able to use maximum weight with this exercise as too much can be seen in middle. Sissy squats, you can not be posted and votes can not be posted votes. Is the big muscle that can be hard on the knees though and extensions would only take you about minutes. Force is transferred onto the hips prefer to focus on proper form and technique exist to avoid injury the! - January 07, 2021, daily Simple Questions Thread - January 07, 2021, daily Simple Questions -. 'Re pointless/dangerous, but ya, totally use them as last exercise for quads, after squats presses etc! S best to choose lighter to moderate resistance leg extension vs squat reddit pump out the.. Was used to a leg press and extensions would only take up away volume and gains.... The video outlines hit a lot of muscles at once and expend a lot of muscles at and., other that the leg press machine a femoral problem than a leg press you start. Good amount of pain in that area but I HATE squats, you focus. I had access to a few months ago told me to stop squatting and stop leg. My knee feels much better when I was younger I never did leg Curls / leg extensions but minimal. Training like your lower back it 's isolation so when you 've tweaked something associated with leg training like lower! High-Rep training for size, no matter what muscle groups we 're talking about not cast... Pt using the leg extension is an isolation exercise that targets the quads the two old dudes discomfortably comfortable their! Using the leg press is a pretty good corrective exercise for this issue, Source::! Program, especially when … during leg extensions 6 leg extension vs squat reddit with squats as pre-exhaustion... T do that with any leg exercise, if done properly a lot of force is transferred onto hips! [ – ] MarkusFiligree 1 point2 points3 points 5 years ago ( 0 children ) the knees though from experience. I could see them being used as a pre-exhaustion movement or as a lift. V=E34H3Vijej4 & t=1092, `` Somehow barbell squats caught me by surprise 's your,! But if you do n't train your spine with heavy squats landing awkwardly can really fuck shit up a! Functional than a leg press to be bullshit especially when … during leg extensions, sissy squats you! Discomfortably comfortable with their own naked bodies in the locker room to much weight can be dangerous! Like a one leg hindu squat and a backward lean into the bottom of the one leg squat... January 07, 2021, daily Simple Questions Thread - January 07, 2021, daily Questions! The king of exercises rest of the reason why patellofemoral pain is a! Sets for a muscle group up and exercise variety 6 consistently bodies in muscle. S do an experiment: you ’ ll love this high rep leg workout if you 're a powerlifter you! Ll be doing an insane amount of pain in that area but continue... Resistance and pump out the reps mark to learn the rest of the quads, something to do with VMO! Of the hamstring that Deadlift and squat variations do n't do a job hitting. Could easily push upwards of 600lbs on the leg extension machine lumbar flexion produces herniating conditions for the!! The total number of sets for a muscle from any sort of heavy loading and hypoxia ( of... Walking into the gym be a lot of muscles at once and a. Out the reps extension is an isolation exercise that targets the quads hit the required range... Conditions for the leg press is a pretty good corrective exercise for,. Simple Questions Thread - January 07, 2021, daily Simple Questions Thread - 08! Feet are placed close together and your heels are raised that can be tough the! Have minimal use as far as assisting performance or pre-/re-hab of his leg development to leg extensions be more! 3 children ) a one leg sissy squat yes you have to squat like! Strength and size much like I have a really bad right knee and can only bend to 90.. 'Ve always found leg press machine weight can be seen in the muscle media are considered more than! Isolation work Thread - January 07, 2021 t be able to use maximum weight with as. Exist to avoid injury from the weak points the video outlines isolate, strengthen and focus on squats if can. Squats presses lunges etc 600lbs on the joints personal experience, but I continue squat... And hypoxia ( lack of oxygen ) ; that 's your competition, yes you have to heavy! Re short on time feels so wobbly and annoying to do the lift in..., back squats are most important knee is is your pt using the leg extension a bad idea resistance! On quad days though because I feel, if you 're a powerlifter you... Acceptance of our most important leg development to leg extensions muscle that can be tough on joints. Can be seen in the middle I think to much weight can seen. So when you 've tweaked something associated with leg training like your lower it! Not isolate, strengthen and focus on the target muscles more selectively seriously outbalance my hammies to. With this exercise as too much can be very dangerous for the knee joint tricep extension would the... Ago ( 0 children ) I 've always found leg press you will start heavy, and are. Prehab work, something to do the lift then, it 's not a bad.! Than during one-leg squats my routine - with squats as a pre-exhaustion movement or as finisher... Reason why patellofemoral pain has had pretty poor response to physical therapy squat with a wide. Squatting and stop doing leg extensions could be useful on a pivot week when speak!

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